Home » Kuleba: “An agreement on grain is possible in two weeks if Moscow won’t attack Odessa”

Kuleba: “An agreement on grain is possible in two weeks if Moscow won’t attack Odessa”

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Kuleba: “An agreement on grain is possible in two weeks if Moscow won’t attack Odessa”

Minister Dmytro Kuleba, according to you, what is the best solution for unblocking Ukraine’s grain exports?

“Launching an international operation in the Black Sea with the help of friendly countries willing to send their ships to demine waters and escort the passage of commercial cargoes, starting with those leaving from Odessa. But it can only be done with a formal commitment from Russia not to use the corridor to attack us”.

This is the hypothesis Scholz, Macron and Putin discussed on the phone. Do you trust the Russians?

“No, nobody can trust the Russians. We have to be extremely careful. That’s why the Kremlin’s unilateral guarantee is not enough for us. We need third countries guaranteeing the enforcement of the agreement. We also agree with a U.N. intervention. Our main interest is that our wheat reaches the nations that need it”.

At what stage are the negotiations?

“At an advanced stage. We are in contact with both the U.N. and the states acting as guarantors”.

When will we see the freighters set sail from Odessa?

“It is a race against time. To avoid disastrous consequences, ports have to be unblocked within two weeks, at the most. Clearly, the best option would be an end to the war, but Putin does not want that”.

Under which conditions will peace negotiations resume?

“We are not setting any specific conditions and have nothing against resuming talks. We just want Russian delegates to show their willingness to have real negotiations. Whereas Putin only knows how to give ultimatums. Look at what is happening now: they are carrying out a brutal invasion in the Donbas, and in the Kherson and Zaporizhzhia regions they are trying to annex occupied territories and firing missiles at cities. If you really want to negotiate, don’t behave like this”.

According to certain rumours, President Zelensky is ready for talks with Putin in the presence of Turkish President Erdogan. Do you confirm this?

“At the moment there is no such possibility. It is true that Erdo?an  is playing an important role in the peace negotiations and will have another round of talks with Zelensky and Putin, separately.”

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Why is Turkey acting as playmaker?

“Since 24 February, Ukraine has welcomed all mediation initiatives put forward by foreign countries. Turkey has achieved the most by organising the summit of the two delegations in Istanbul. Many tried, and Erdo?an succeeded. We really count on him”.

The Italian proposal was rejected both by Moscow and Kiev. What was wrong with it?

“All proposals are welcome, but on one condition: the territorial integrity of Ukraine is a prerequisite. Besides, the clamour of the media around the Italian plan did not help, but that’s just my personal opinion. In any case, Italy is sincere. Whereas some countries pretend to be interested in mediation to maintain direct and friendly relations with Putin. Their proposals are not welcome”.

Which countries are you referring to?

“I would rather be tactful, at least regarding this…”

Are you in contact with the Azovstal fighters detained in the separatist republic of Donetsk?

“We are in contact with the Russians; we are working to bring our soldiers home. We believe they are treated adequately”.

Donbas Pro-Russians want a Nuremberg-style trial. If they obtain it, will it be the final obstacle to peace negotiations?

“Every war ends with peace. From an ideal point of view, nothing should ruin negotiations and one must always leave a space to negotiate. But if they decide to go ahead with the trial it would complicate everything.”

Some people believe that Great Britain and the United States are not really interested in a ceasefire and prefer instead a long-term conflict to weaken the Russian Federation as much as possible.

“There will always be people in the West who believe that to keep tranquillity you have to hug and kiss Putin, allowing him to have everything he wants. Some people are paid by the Kremlin to think this way. While others are intellectually dependent on Russia and can’t see that we are not dealing with Pushkin, Tchaikovsky or Dostoevsky, but with people who are killing our children and raping our women. I don’t believe at all that the U.S. and Great Britain prefer war. On the contrary, we really appreciate their help”.

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How are relations with Italy?

“In recent months, Minister Luigi Di Maio has shown he is a skilled politician who honours his commitments. Zelensky has an excellent relationship with Prime Minister Draghi, who has understood that Europe will be safe only if Ukraine wins the war.”

In the meantime, the sixth package of sanctions, which includes a ban on Russian oil, has not yet been formally approved by EU countries.

“It would be really embarrassing if they didn’t. It would mean that Putin has succeeded in his intent to split the European Union”.

Some countries, like Hungary, have doubts because giving up Russian oil could lead to an economic crisis. What is your answer?

“I believe that breaking the dependence on Russian oil and gas is in the interest of the EU, because Putin has shown he can use these resources as a weapon to exert pressure, and he is also charging double for them. He finances his invasion with the proceeds. To whomever thinks the ban is impossible, I ask: didn’t you say you meant to respect the ‘green agenda’ and switch to eco-sustainable resources? Hypocrisy can be resolved with sanctions on Russia”.

Is European support for Ukraine as solid as it was at the beginning of the conflict?

“Yes. However, some voices are less strong because some people have become accustomed to this war. Not us Ukrainians. We just can’t get used to it”.

Besides sanctions on Russian oil, what are you asking for?

“The goal is to bring the Russian economy to its knees, so as to prevent Putin from buying weapons and paying the army. It’s a country that depends to a great extent on its exports, mainly by sea, so we are asking for foreign trade to be stopped and that the export of gas, iron and nuclear energy to Europe be blocked through sanctions”.

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Do you realise that the economic effect of the sanctions will be huge for some countries?

“There will be consequences, but they won’t be devastating. It is the price that has to be paid to stop the conflict. To mitigate the overall impact, some essential goods can be excluded during a first phase”.

The Ukrainian soldiers we spoke to in the Donbas say they have not yet received all the weapons partner countries promised them. What is the situation like?

“I take the opportunity of this interview to ask the West, once again, to send us all the 155 mm cannons and multiple missile launcher systems they can send us”.

It appears that Germany is behind with its delivery.

“There are countries we are waiting for to deliver and countries we are tired of waiting for. Germany belongs to the second group.”

Zelensky said that you will not be able to take back the Donbas and Crimea. Are you preparing to lose the two areas?

“We will not lose them. Zelensky only said it is better to regain them through diplomatic means to avoid unspeakable human losses. Our strategy is to recover everything we can by military means, and the rest by diplomatic means. We need to find the balance between the two ways”.

Are you preparing the counteroffensive in the Donbas and Kherson?

“If we had received weapons from the West on time, we would have already liberated Kherson and other areas. The time will come to launch the counteroffensive. We are at war with a country that has a president who hates us and does not want us to exist. We will never surrender”.

Translated by Barbara Bacci

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